Jul 18, 2011

Re: Dr. Toben: Let's get over Hitler and Jews


The world doesn't revolve around Israel or Hitler or even the Palestinians.  I live with enough petty strife with 9/11 theorists and imaginary science.
Were you to have listened more carefully and with a better grasp of English, you would note that the phrases you think you heard are more than simply out of context, they are fabricated.
Suggest you listen again.
As for Hitler, we have barely begun reexamining him.  The issue here is that the process has become discredited by the amateur antics of many of your "revisionist" friends.
In a message dated 7/18/2011 10:37:05 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, writes:

Begin forwarded message:

From: "Fredrick Toben" <>
Date: July 18, 2011 9:15:49 PM EDT
To: <>
Cc: "'Michael'" <>, "'Josef Schwanzer'" <>
Subject: Let's get over Hitler and Jews

1. But Gordon, you are then perpetuating a myth that contains no new impulses to better a situation, locally or globally, because that myth you are perpetuating is full of lies. Why don't you grasp the nettle and in truly anticipatory-pioneering fashion open a dialogue with those who claim that

"A slave is one who can speak neither well of Hitler nor ill of Jewry."<<

2. We need to get away from this Marxist-Talmudic death dialectic and move into a Hegelian dialogue dialectic where guilt-by-association as a principle of research is rejected outright. I tend to regard an individual who still claims that Hitler/Nazis are the absolute evil as someone who is out of balance as regards the understanding of human nature and of the historical process as such.

3. That is why individuals who can't get over Hitler/Nazis display a deeply authoritarian mindset and fear free expression from which they then 'protect' themselves by developing a range of guilt-by-association strategies. We see this so clearly in the global warming/Holocaust debate that is pushed mainly by ex-lefties who still frantically wish to retain mind control of individuals who refuse to think globally but prefer to think nationally.

4. Among ordinary individuals I hear the cry for freedom from global economic exploitation and oppression and towards some form of community-local-regional/state nation building where the command is upwards from the people and not downwards to the people.

5. This cry from the people upwards may contain elements of what Germany did during the 12 years under Adolf Hitler and the National Socialists - NAZI – but that era/period cannot be replicated/duplicated in today's world, and in any case it was specifically German – and can you imagine how the world's population would react if it had imposed on it by force such values as order, beauty/cleanliness, honesty/transparent actions, creativity instead of change for change's sake, justice instead of vicious financial exploitation, and others?

6. Currently in Australia the issue of animal slaughter is a burning issue because our trade with Indonesia reveals that our cattle are brutally slaughtered, and now we demand slaughter houses stun the animal before slitting their throats. This issue has focused on local practices and Muslim groups do not oppose the stunning of animals but Jews do. The claim that kosher slaughter is a religious right is now developing into an issue – I can already hear the cries of 'antisemitism' and 'racism' and 'Nazi' that attempt to stifle debate on this contentious issue.

7. And then we just have to recall that Adolf Hitler and the National Socialists on 21 April 1933 enacted a law that banned kosher slaughter, thereby attacking a prime pillar of the Jewish religion. The Holocaust-Shoah mythology, of course, is now there to deflect from this 1933 German humane act of opposition to kosher slaughter. The reasoning is that Germans exterminated the Jews so what gives them the right to say anything about anything at all! Well, as you know Gordon through your ethnic background this Holocaust-Shoah – Hitler/Jew dialectic is a process full of exaggerations, distortions, fabrications, and outright lying that prevents us from gaining new insights into current and historical happenings in the world.

8. Upon reflection this is why I consider my meeting you at your home was valuable because I see you as someone who embodies these principles – as well, of course, the principle of AUTARKY from which the self emerges as an empathetic and fearless mature individual where the concept of 'change' has no home because individuals don't change but develop and mature - hopefully.

9. As to your claim that Murdoch is Jewish – it's irrelevant to me because I still claim that 'don't blame the Jews, blame those that bend to their pressure'. Thus what is far more important is that the whole controversy in London has led to the resignation of two policemen who were intimately involved in counter-terrorism operations, and by implication directly involved in the 7:7 2005 London bombing exercise. This follows closely on the US event that saw the writing out of their terrorism script the protagonist, Osama bin laden, by spreading the word that he was killed – again utter nonsense. In other words, in British politics there is a re-adjustment taking place in the usual dramatic and practical sense that also continues to keep the real impulses behind the scene protected from public scrutiny. There is even another death to hand – and Dr Kelley's death comes to mind when the WMD story had served its purpose and was finally exposed as a lie.

10. I'm sending a copy of this email to Santomauro and Schwanzer so that they can also spread my thoughts expressed therein, and in the hope that some commentary will be made on it.


Fredrick Töben

From: []
Sent: Monday, 18 July 2011 10:40 PM
Subject: Re: FW: Gordon Duff

I am aware that our policies here in Ohio are not like Nazi Germany


one has to use language that people understand

In a message dated 7/18/2011 6:36:22 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, writes:

Gordon - will you let yourself be upset with my comment on your site?


-----Original Message-----
From: Fredrick Toben []
Sent: Monday, 18 July 2011 7:54 PM
Subject: RE: Gordon Duff

>>If the tyrant's head is chopped off, then what have we left?

A culture of slaves who will seek another tyrant for their comforts.

Currently the characteristics of a slave are thus:

"A slave is one who can speak neither well of Hitler nor ill of Jewry."<<

 FredrickToben 1 second ago


-----Original Message-----

Sent: Monday, 18 July 2011 7:33 PM

To: Fredrick Toben

Subject: Gordon Duff

Did you hear this? Gordon Duff says at approx 3.35:   

"Rupert Murdoch spent personally $10 Million to elect a Governor in 

the State of Ohio whose policies are reprehensible - we would equal 

them to Nazi Germany"


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